whats wrong with people??

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whats wrong with people??

Postby johnonthetyne » Sat Jun 12, 2010 7:10 pm

while browsing the mgf forum i came across THIS thread, none seems happy with the motor theyve got , i see alans looking at puting k-series in midas instead of a-series and then theres this bloke that wants to put an a-series instead of a k!!
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Re: whats wrong with people??

Postby Stuart » Sat Jun 12, 2010 7:46 pm

Alan could do him a swap :P
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Re: whats wrong with people??

Postby johnonthetyne » Sat Jun 12, 2010 7:48 pm

yes stuart i thought that but he said it was kerry packered.
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Re: whats wrong with people??

Postby manifold » Sun Jun 13, 2010 11:08 am

In my opinion and only going with my own experiences theres nothing really wrong with the A series bottom end. If you beef up the gearbox with a support bearing and put a metal caged race in the pinion bearing and go for a longer final drive matched with the Pierce 7 port. I havent rolling roaded mine yet, but a couple of examples I have heard of recently are pushing out 135 and 145 hp, which is more than acceptable in a Midas. Pierce themselves rate it at 137 hp.

Since fitting the Pierce 7 port as a 'temporary fix' so I can drive the car this summer I can say have been very happy with it. More than I envisaged. It is on 40 dcoe's so its quite loud but put it on fuel injection with tapered throttle bodies on it and you will have a thoroughly modern feel to the car. For day to day driving, probably avoid the straight cut transfers.

All engines have their faults. The K series is probably overrated anyway due to said issues with sealing. Nice engine design, but average sealing lasts about what 60-70k? so not really any more reliable than an A series is it? I've had A series lasting well over 100k with no probs as long as oil was changed regular, even with shit oil.
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Re: whats wrong with people??

Postby rocketron » Sun Jun 13, 2010 9:22 pm

Over the past few months I've banged on about Suzuki 1300 tc engines as a good conversion, for those that really want to convert, that is. But I have to agree with Dave Manifold, a well built A series takes some beating. I did 170k on a s/h 1071s. It was reasonably tuned and really good on fuel. I changed the oil regularly: in my opinion this is vital to longevity. If you got an A series and it just wanted a refresh, it would be a shame not to. You don't need to spend an awful lot to rebuild it. Unless you want huge power, then it costs, of course.
For me, anything approaching 100bhp at the wheels in a mini is real hard work if you really need to press on in the rain and in winter. My other car, a Fabia diesel, is not as quick nor as rewarding to drive. I do a frequent journey from North to South Wales and back in one go with a small break in the middle, always after work and late evenings. I've had it, physically, after one way in the mini, but both ways in the Fabia, usually about 2 1/2 hrs each way and never less than 47mpg.( and I've still got my hearing after!)
Don't get me wrong, I LOVE hot Midas/ minis. In my opinion, it would be a great shame to put a hairy engine in your Midas and it becoming tiresome if used as an everyday car.
I've done it.
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Re: whats wrong with people??

Postby Rich » Sun Jun 13, 2010 10:08 pm

I've probably posted this before, but a friend of mine was a development engineer on the K series project. In his words, an awesome engine ruined by accountants.

Personally I've had two sub 80k engines twist themselves into balls of scrap and I'd need some convincing to ever fit one to a car of mine. My Midas is my everyday car and something like a bike engine feels as though it would be a pain in the arse to live with. As mentioned above some of the small Japanese engines have real potential, but here's a thought... I'm currently running a Subaru Justy as a bit of a toy, it has a seriously compact 3 cylinder 1200cc engine that happily revs past 7k with a solid 70bhp in unmodified form. Apparently these engines respond well to head porting and can run at 100bhp afterwards and can be turbo'd to go beyond without gearbox worries.
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Re: whats wrong with people??

Postby Hans Efde » Mon Jun 14, 2010 8:10 am

I couldn't agree more with Rich. To gain experience with the K-engine I bought a Rover 214 MPI (124bhp) as the family transport. It was horrid. Low on torque, noisy and unreliable. Every 30K km's the waterpump failed. There were starting problems, but the computer could not be used for diagnosis. By shotgun trouble shooting a few sensors were replaced and that helped. It's a terrible engine, when I would upgrade I would go for Japanese.
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Re: whats wrong with people??

Postby rocketron » Mon Jun 14, 2010 6:30 pm

I agree with Rich and Hans: my experience with K series is two Rover minis both with crap engines. Both were regularly serviced by Rover and both failed before 40k. Now, I know that many use K series in Caterhams and Westfields for racing, but I cannot be persuaded of their longevity.
The Subaru Justy 1200 3 cylinder was my first 4wd car, huge mid-range torque, revved like anything and was never a problem. I don't know whose engine base it was, perhaps Suzuki. My second Justy was 1300 4cylinder, based on a Suzuki Swift, awd system fitted in Hungary and very expensive when new. This was an ex-demo from Subaru in Pangborne. With its awd system it handled brilliantly but was crap compared to the first one in the snow, which had selectable 4wd.
The second Justy was definately Suzuki engine, about 75bhp, and I did not think it would last as good as the 3cyl, although was nicer at higher revs. I thrashed the nuts off this for 92k and only serviced as per normal. I did not have to put any new parts whatsoever, absolutely nothing. I sold it to a neighbour for top price and he's done more than 60k since, with no failures of any kind.
You may gather that I have great faith in the engineering quality of these engines from Suzuki. Both the 1200 and 1300 Justy engines can be tuned to very high levels indeed and are still reliable.
Recently, a Suzuki 1300tc turbo has come to my possession and I believe it delivers about 172bhp at the wheels. I'm certain it's lighter than an A series and will probably be fitted to Ginetta G15.
Hans is corect, go for a lightweight Jap motor.
Ron
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Re: whats wrong with people??

Postby Geoff Butcher » Mon Jun 14, 2010 8:00 pm

A bit tricky fitting other engines in a G15 - the only successful ones I know of are Alfasuds. What is the layout of this Suzuki engine/box?
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Re: whats wrong with people??

Postby Rich » Mon Jun 14, 2010 10:02 pm

As far as I'm aware the J12 Subaru engine is an original design by Subaru (Fuji Heavy Industries), I forgot to mention the three valves per cylinder and given my history with failing cam belts, it's also a non-interference engine thankfully.
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